*I am not Dr Mosley nor do I represent him.* Any responsible author or medical professional would advise checking with your family doctor/ childrens nurse/ hospital specialist/ dietician/ pharmacist before embarking on an elimination diet (cutting out an entire food group or type) or adding any supplements to your children’s diets.

However the ongoing phase of the Clever Guts Diet fits in pretty well with UK official healthy eating guidelines.

Minimising processed starches and sugars, more healthy fats inc. oily fish and olive oil, eating a really wide variety of wholefoods from all the food groups, appropriate portion sizes …

The average UK family eats too much processed stuff, and not enough overall variety. For example wheat products – cereal/ bread/ pasta/ biscuits/ cake – two or more times a day. A wider variety of foods means a wider variety of nutrients.

Eating more oily fish, certain seeds and high cocoa dark chocolate supplies vitamin D, magnesium and omega-3s, which act alongside calcium (from dairy) in bone health, immune function and brain development. The fibre, polyphenols and protein all help keep the gut healthy.

HTH!

The timing when the Potato starch is taken may also be interesting, in the book Michael says he takes 1 teaspoon full before bed, but also earlier in the book it mentions taking a teaspoon full in the early evening. I wonder how crucial the timing could be as presumably the starch will take some time to get down to the good guys, so they can get to work on it and start producing their sleep promoting goodies. Maybe the trial could involve different protocols…..

As the study will be following Michael Mosely’s regime, I would suggest going along with his quantity: 1 teaspoon in milk at bedtime

Interested in joining the study but impatient with the time its taken to get it off the ground….
I note some people seem to be starting to take it and interested in the amounts people are taking. There’s some interesting info here: http://www.gestaltreality.com/2014/02/27/resistant-starch-a-concise-guide/ which seems to suggest at least two tablespoons is required and taking it 4-5 hours before bedtime. That’s a lot more than I was thinking would be necessary!

Hello, I’d like to sign up for the trial. Please let me know when it starts.

Everyone, including me, seems to be asking where and how to sign up for the potato starch trial. I haven’t seen any answers yet. Has anyone signed up? Is anyone monitoring this forum?

When I heard Dr Mosley say that prebiotics might help sleep problems, I didn’t know that he meant potato starch. I began taking a dessert spoonful of psyllium husks stirred into a large glass of water at bedtime. I was astounded to find that although I am in my late 60s, I started getting eight hours a night of refreshing sleep. The disadvantage is that psyllium husks are marketed as a laxative, and I found that after a couple of weeks I needed to take a break. Has anyone else tried psyllium husks to help sleep? Does it really work? I try to tell my friends about it, but they only give me funny looks.

I’ve decided to give it a go anyway – what have I got to lose!! ( Only sleep!!??!!) Going to try a rounded spoonful per day – I put some in soup and seems ok. Can add it to my kefir and muesli in the mornings from now on……….

Just wondering if anyone has experience with this – have been looking at something called “Heal Your Gut” Powder which is diatomaceous earth. Realise one can get a bit hopeful with the sort of claims made for it.
This Dr Axe post covers it in general: https://draxe.com/diatomaceous-earth/
Grateful for any comments.

Hi Pam, thank you for replying to my request. It seems that a daily dose of olive oil has worked well for your friend so I’ll definitely pass on the tip to my daughter-in-law so thank you very much.

Hi Wilf,

Thank you for replying to my request. That was strange advice you got about partners! You’ve clearly experimented a lot to find what works for you. It does seem to be very individual but some common themes seem to arise when you talk to lots of suffers. She’s already cut out coffee and spicy food and she’s pretty teetotal anyway. I think the turmeric and oily fish will be worth her trying and I agree with you on the evils of white bread (even for healthy people). I will pass your experiences and advice onto her so thanks you very much.

Thanks for raising this issue, Ed. I too was very surprised to see coconut oil mentioned frequently in the recipes, although the text recommends a Mediterranean diet. While celebrity endorsements and anecdotal evidence abounds, I haven’t been able to find any evidence of proper studies showing that coconut oil is good for you. Has anyone else? Thanks

Hi Slaura

I have no personal experience of ulcerative colitis, but a friend has suffered from it for many years. The best treatment he found was recommended by his consultant who wanted to follow his progress over time. This was one tablespoon of extra virgin olive oil every day. He has followed it faithfully for ten years and never had a flare-up in that period. Checks show a vast improvement in his condition. I think its worth a try.

My first thought when reading your initial post was “straw that broke the camel’s back?”

It sounds like your body has been under great stress/ strain lately: the initial illness, antibiotics, stomach problem, restrictive diet (Lipotrim), unintentional/ rapid(?) weight loss. Lots of potential for inflammation (gout is inflammatory …)

I wonder how the release of fat and protein from your ‘stores’ (ie. muscle and bodyfat) and your organs processing of of that affects gout. A question for a dietician or doctor!

I would suggest working on prebiotic intake, in order to feed the good microbes from the fermented foods you can tolerate. As Dr Mosley advises, *at least* seven portions of fruit and veg a day from the full rainbow (blue/ purple, red, yellow/ orange as well as green). Plus some beans/ lentils/ nuts/ seeds as you can tolerate.

Secondly monitoring, and potentially reducing, your intake of animal protein and animal fats.

http://www.arthritis.org/about-arthritis/types/gout/articles/purine-foods-gout-attack.php

Do limit your portions to official guidelines: meat and fish the size and thickness of your palm or a deck of cards (100g+), harder/ high fat cheeses the size of a matchbox (~30g). Even then these are surprisingly high in protein, so it may well be meals OR snacks.

I really feel for you: I love my aged/ cured meats, mature cheeses and alcohol! 🙂

I am very interested in joining the potato starch trial.

Hello Michael
I’ve adjusted my eating along the lines of the suggestions in the clever guts book for about a week now and I’m feeling great.
Thank you.
I’m now wondering if you recommend that children follow a similar diet plan, or do they need something different as their systems are still developing? I have two children – 7 and 11 years old – and while I’m very interested in feeding them in a healthy way I don’t want to deprive them of any essential nutrients in this growing phase of their lives.
What would you recommend?
Any chance you will be releasing a children’s version of the clever guts diet in the near future?? 😉

I live alone but am blessed with a decent amount of kitchen cupboards and a freezer. I am now on long term sick so low-ish income. I don’t have a sunny windowsill to grow anything. My plan is to eat:

*Longer life fresh vegetables*

Red onion
Shallots
Carrot
Beetroot
Purple cauliflower
Long green bell peppers
Red/ yellow/ orange bell peppers

*Shorter life fresh vegetables*

Green onions
Romaine lettuce
Baby spinach
Mixed colour tomatoes
Avocado
Chestnut mushrooms
Baby corn
Sugarsnap peas

*Frozen vegetables*

Edamame/ green soy beans
Leeks
Mediterranean veg

*Longlife vegetables*
Canned tomatoes
Sunblush tomatoes
Dried shiitake mushrooms

*Occasionally/ should be more often!*

Fine asparagus
Watercress
Frozen kale
Frozen celery
Frozen butternut squash

*Fresh fruit*

Green apples
Mango

*Frozen fruit*

Redcurrants
Blackcurrants
Blackberries
Blueberries
Cherries
Rhubarb

*Longlife fruit*

Dried sour cherries
Block creamed coconut
Canned ruby red grapefruit

*Occasionally/ should eat less often!*

Dried pineapple
Dried mango
Banana.

On page 110 of The Clever Guts Diet, Dr Mosley concludes some warnings about fish oil capsules often being rancid and useless by suggesting: “If you really, really don’t like fish, I would recommend cod liver oil.”

My question: why are cod liver oil capsules less likely to contain rancid oil? Wouldn’t you also have to bite into one of those, as a sample, and see if it tastes or smells “off”? Just like we’re recommended to do with other fish-oil capsules?

Otherwise, what am I missing here?

Thanks.

HTH, thanks for the reply.
My diet hasn’t really changed dramatically, I (think) In Feb 2017 I was given a large dose of antibiotics and then the problems started. Not being ABLE to eat for stomach pain, I used some LipoTrim packs which I had in stock [all the nutrients but no massive calorie input] overall lost 21Lbs. Slowly I went back into small solid foods.
From a CHANGE point of view, I dropped wine for Becks Blue (0%) – sometimes 3 a day. Proteins? Yes, seafood, shellfish, fresh fish 3 times a week. Chicken, Steak, plenty of greens – but asparagus and avocado??, no sugars ……no change. Then assuming it may? be as described in Michaels book, I started with Kombucha for a week, then I made Kefir and ‘feelings’ were much better – then BOOM. The blood test haven’t come back yet, but I’m on Colchicine and as I write the Gout has almost gone – BUT I’ve dropped all heavy proteins and especially the Kefir and the beer. Strangely 1/2 bottle of red wine hasn’t made any difference – so it has to be one (or all) of the purine heavy foods or drink. I’m probably going to start again with ‘fermented’ slowly, but the penalty of an attack is horrendous. Any observations????

In ‘The Clever Guts Diet’, Dr Mosley advises to “include at least seven portions a day of veg and fruit, made up mainly of vegetables. And make them colourful. Variety is important for gut health, so try to eat 20 to 30 varieties a week.” (p.191)

How do you plan to hit this target?

Will you be ‘flying solo’ on the diet, or eating as a household?

Are you on a budget?

Does anyone know what’s happening? Maybe it’s a joke!

I can’t offer any clinical advice as I’m a tree surgeon not a bowel surgeon. However, I do have UC and its limited to my lower bowel so I guess that makes me lucky. I’ve had no medication in the four years since being diognosed and have had a number of flare ups. I was told that diet won’t change things, only having different partents would help!
My findings and experience over the last four years are as follows. Stress and sleep definitiely make things worse. Stay clear of spicy food and instant coffee, they both make my guts gurgle. Stopping all alcohol is very beneficial and I’ve found that it can sometime send it into remission completely. Alcohol must be really bad for you because the effect of stopping was quite dramatic with me. Although I still allow my self a G&T or some red wine. I’ve also tried Gluten Free and followed the Clever Gut Diet advice which also helped. Dropped the white bread and increased my intake of fibre and yoghurt and fruit and oily fish. I mix Turmeric in with yohurt, honey, apple and granola…..sounds yuck but I love it now.
Good luck and I hope she start feeling better soon.

Any one out there taking it care to share their experiences?
My wife, I and a friend have been taking it for about a month, we’ve had mixed results:
I haven’t noticed any differences, however I had no issues I was aware of I was just hoping to give my gut bacteria a treat.
My wife has been a poor sleeper for years and suffered bloating and constipation regularly, she appears to be drastically improved in all respects.
Our friend (poor sleeper) suffered stomach ache when taking it but persevered (for 3 weeks) hoping the symptoms would reduce in time, however they didn’t and she couldn’t tolerate it any longer so has stopped taking it.

I would also like to sign up for the Potato Starch study, Thanks xxx

I’ve already asked about joining the potato starch study and have bought the potato starch. I don’t sleep well waking up about 5 times a night. Haven’t received any reply as where to sign up. Mo Milsom

Having just bought a bag of potato starch to assist with my baking and suffering from poor sleep, I’d also be keen to join the trial.

I would like to sign up for the potato starch study. Thanks

Hello, this message is for Michael if possible. I have been working as a traditional acupuncturist for over 16 years, and am also a qualified nurse/midwife. I am currently on a Return to Practice course in Nursing. I have always had a strong interest in health, nutrition, healthy lifestyle, and disease prevention, and have been giving similar advice (to the Clever Guts diet)to my patients/clients over the years – especially regarding increase of fermented foods into the diet.
It is of great concern to me to see the huge increase in chronic diseases since I last practised as a nurse, and I am really keen to find some kind of a research role in gut health, as I find it fascinating, and of paramount importance to improving health and preventing disease.
It is great to see a book like this becoming more of a mainstream approach.
Can Michael (or anyone else who might know!) advise me on the best way forward in getting into this field?
Many thanks.

I’ve had migraines for 45 years and although you can avoid certain triggers (which sadly for me includes virtually all alcoholic drinks), my biggest problem is over exerting myself – although I rarely feel as if I am over exerting myself. This makes me wonder if it has a connection with energy released from food by my gut. Anyone have a similar problem? Found anything that helps?

Pia
I’m a 61 year old woman living in Brisbane currently taking Methotrexate for severe psoriasis. Like all psoriasis sufferers I’m looking for a little bit of magic that won’t eventually destroy my liver or any other organs or increase my risk of melanoma. When I’m not taking Methotrexate, the psoriasis covers between 50 and 80% of my body. I’d be very interested in your future trials.

Thanks
Dez

Hi Pia
I have already posted via your website, but just in case. Would you add two more interested in the capsules to your list. I would also be very interested to read your final paper.
Thank you.

Sorry to read that you have had a flare up. 🙁

GPs are generalists, not specialists in nutrition/ dietetics/ lifestyle modification/ gout and arthritis. They tend to opt for the solution that is fastest acting and/ or backed by the most scientific evidence. This is often a prescription drug (allopurinol, for example, has been used for decades).

Have you been keeping a detailed food and symptom diary, with weighed or measured quantities?

If yes consider:

– if your regular diet and lifestyle meets or exceeds UK official recommendations for healthy eating/ specific recommendations in gout (registered dietician or relevant charities)/ the CG Diet book

– what foods you subtracted to add in the fermented foods (so as not to gain excess weight or overwork the gut)

– how the dairy (esp. the cheeses) impacted your overall daily intake of animal proteins/ animal fats.

It is REALLY easy to eat too much protein when having it at meals and for snacks. It is a lot more challenging to overeat low sugar fruits and non starchy vegetables!

HTH.

Michael mentions Pia Winberg and the surprising, and unexpected, results of one of the study group who suffered from psoriasis which cleared when taking the seaweed capsules she is trialling. While waiting for her capsules to become available in the UK can anyone recommend a good brand of seaweed capsule I could try please?

Has anyone any ideas about or used GI and GL?
If used, should the values be totalled for the day’s intake or averaged?

Dr Mosley (p.191) advocates *at least* seven brightly coloured portions of fruit and veg a day, mainly vegetables. And a wide variety: twenty to thirty different ones a week!

In the UK an official serving of fresh or frozen fruit and veg is 80g, dried (no added sugar) is 30g. Beans or lentils count once per day.

Frozen, canned or dried fruit and veg can be cheaper per portion than fresh, often with little prep time and little waste!

Frozen fruit:

Farmfoods current long-ish term offer three packs for £5 inc. summer, mango, pineapple, blueberries, blackberries, strawberries.

Of all the fruits strawberries and mango defrost the worst IMO.

Mixed summer fruits try Tesco Value (£3.50 for 1kg) or Farmfoods (£2 for 600g)

Blueberries try Aldi (£1.50 for 300g) or Iceland (£1.50 for 300g)

Blackberries try Farmfoods or Tesco (£2 for 350g)

Raspberries try Lidl (£2.40 for 500g) or Aldi (£1.50 for 300g) or Iceland (£1.50 for 300g)

Cherries try Tesco (£2 for 500g) or Lidl (mixed berries £2.40 for 750g)

Rhubarb try Farmfoods (£1 for 750g)

Pineapple or mango try Farmfoods or Iceland

Tropical smoothie mixes try Sainsbury’s or Morrison’s or Iceland

Mixed peach/ nectarine slices try Sainsbury’s (£2 for 500g)

Tried making the Rainbow Ratatouelle from the recipe in the book but the quantities must be wrong. 4 sweet potatoes 4 beetroot 3 onions 2 peppers, butternut squash, fennel bulb… It just wouldn’t fit even in the largest dish I had and I only used 2 sweet potatoes.

Tasted great but didn’t look anything like the picture in the middle of the book (which I found after I had tried to make it).

Come on Claire did you really use all the ingredients?

Hi everyone. Don’t ever develop GOUT, my god it is seriously painful. I’ve had it twice in 5 years – probably from alcohol binges, but recently – because of stomach ‘problems, I read Michael’s book, ‘ and after experimenting with ‘Fermented Food & Drink’ – I had (and still have it as I write) a very very painful Gout attack. I’m now 6 weeks into experimenting (experifermenting 😉 and something has brought on the attack?? My chosen products are Kombucha, Kefir, Sauerkraut, Gorgonzola and Roquefort (live) Cheeses…… Buying ready made Kombucha is easy so that was the first sampling….. No problems – in fact great improvements to the stomach twinges. The second was Kefir…… Never heard of it, but bought a fresh culture and within 24 hrs was growing my own source. 3 days later I had my first taste……Jeez, it’s like drinking strong sour yoghurt (but not ‘off’ or mouldy)…..No problems. As Michaels’ book suggests “slowly introduce other foods/drinks”. The next was Sauerkraut (fermented but pasteurised Cabbage)……. No problems.
Snacking – I delved into the cheeses…… No problems……then BOOM!!!!! Gout, manifesting itself as pain in the big toe and under the ball of the foot……….So much so, I had to ask my NHS Doc’s “What’s the problem and how can I cure it”?? [Standard response – pills!!!!] “Can I have a blood test – now” The best they could do was 14th of July – 3 weeks!!!! Are they mad or just stretched???? So the only way of finding out what is going on is a FULL private BLOOD test and as I await the results of yesterday [26th June] I wish to ask you ‘Friends of Fermenting’………. HAS ANYONE HAD A REACTION LIKE GOUT??????

If you have a smartphone or tablet, download the apps for the Big Four supermarkets plus Iceland/ Lidl/ Aldi, depending which stores you can travel to. This allows you to compare prices per kilo and/ or check weekly offers.

Lidl has Pick of the Week – four discounted seasonal fresh produce items – which changes weekly on a Thursday. Aldi has Super Six, which *usually* changes fortnightly on a Thursday (but different over Xmas and Easter).

If you can’t download apps check online, or pick up a leaflet in store.

Tesco and Asda have something similar: end of aisle at the front of the fruit and veg section as you enter the store. I haven’t sussed out how this is advertised or the day it changes.

These offers can be really good: eg. whole pineapple for 50p, purple sprouting broccoli for 70p. Some items are suitable for freezing, some last ages if stored well.

The second in a series of ‘information sharing’ threads. As such PLEASE contribute: I am here to learn too!

Remainder of the introduction is on an earlier thread

http://www.cleverguts.com/forums/topic/money-time-saving-flavourings-seasonings/

Bellaboo: the CG diet advocates at least seven servings each day of brightly coloured non starchy vegetables and lower sugar fruits. These are naturally low calorie.

Add to that eliminating or heavily reducing foods and drinks that contribute most to the excess calories in the standard UK/ US diet (alcohol, processed starches, added sugars, ‘bad’ fats). Then increasing but measuring ‘good’ fats (olive oil/ nuts/ seeds/ oily fish) and filling prebiotic fibre and we should struggle to overeat.

HI,
I would be very interested in trying either the potato starch or the pre-biotic fibre study.
Thanks

Bellaboo: I don’t think Dr Mosley intends us to do both at once. But rather give our guts/ microbiomes all the nutrients they need to repair, recover, regenerate.

By their very natures, elimination diets AND calorie controlled diets are restrictive.

By controling portion size and number (official and book recommendations), balancing food groups, listening to your hunger signals you should not overeat.

A 5ml teaspoon in medicine/ pharmacy/ research would normally be level. Then the dose is similar person to person, and similar whatever dosing device is used (measuring spoon, measuring cup, oral syringe).

Whereas some chefs throw in quarter of a bottle of something, and call it two tablespoons! That sort of portion control contributed to the obesity epidemic …

HTH!

I would like to do the join the Potato starch survey

A shame the clever guts diet did not have the calorie content of the recipes, for people trying to heal their gut and lose weight.

Sorry to hear that. It sounds as if getting gut bacteria checked is the thing to do. Hopefully availability and cost will improve as more people want this done. I agree it sounds the best way to go for multiple sensitivities and especially in your case. I Intend to do this too. JennyC.

Soy sauce or tamari (gluten-free) sauce:

Kikkoman naturally brewed soy sauce (43% less salt)

*naturally brewed has a much more complex flavour than supermarket soy sauce. Refill a small bottle from a one litre bottle (<£6)*

Odysea pomegranate molasses (no added sugar). Amazon, Sainsburys ~£3
*Mymoune brand is nicer but far more expensive! *

Taj or Cofresh frozen crushed garlic/ crushed ginger/ garlic & ginger cubes. ~£1 for 400g; Indian/ Pakistani/ Middle Eastern grocers, or larger city Big Four supermarkets

Chilli:
I love spice and heat so have numerous products! Easy/ lazy – and often cheaper – alternatives to fresh chilli peppers include chilli powder, dried flakes, jar chopped (mild/ medium red), frozen crushed (hot green).

Nishaan minced red chilli (jar); Amazon, larger Indian/ Pakistani/ Middle Eastern grocers, or World Foods aisle of larger supermarkets

*hotter than Batts (Lidl or Aldi)*

Belazu rose harissa Middle Eastern spice paste. Amazon, Sainsbury’s ~£4

*Asda harissa paste has similar ingredients and slightly cheaper*

Santa Maria Mexican chipotle paste (57% smoked peppers, 38% tomato) Amazon, Morrisons £1.50

Asda dried smoked chipotle chilli flakes.
£1

Other oils/ fats:

Aldi Specially Selected Puglian extra virgin olive oil PDO Terra di Bari Castel del Monte

*Also see the Mediterranean Diet forum*

Aldi Specially Selected British cold pressed rapeseed oil

*Also see the Mediterranean Diet forum*

Yeo Valley British organic salted butter

*No UK cattle are 100% grass fed due to the weather. Organic farm animals are not routinely treated with antibiotics, so should have a healthy microbiome*

Vinegars:

Apple cider vinegar ‘with the mother’ (unpasteurised/ unfiltered/ live/ raw)

*see the Newbies & the Probiotics forums*

Sainsbury’s red wine vinegar

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/foodanddrink/foodanddrinkadvice/9306497/Expert-Taste-Test-Sam-Harris-on-red-wine-vinegar.html

Aldi Solesta aceto balsamico di Modena IGP

*The Grocer gold award winner 2015*

http://www.independent.co.uk/extras/indybest/food-drink/best-balsamic-vinegars-10364530.html%3Famp

Next planned purchase is black rice vinegar. Please suggest products available in the UK!

Hi everyone,

I wasn’t sure where to put this.

But has anyone been having any noticeable side effects from taking acv?

I do have ibs like symptoms but those havent chanhed much since taking it. I’ve been taking it for about 4 or 5 days now and I’ve been finding that I’ve been peeing an awful lot more and I’ve been having some abdominal pains, possibly my bladder. Has anyone else suffered with this?

Thanks

I started taking Lamberts FOS prebiotic a week ago. So far it has given me nothing more than a lot of wind, some diarrhoea and a general feeling that my gut isn’t enjoying this much!
I am on the 5g dose.
Should I continue?
Is anyone else using this?
I’m taking it to firstly help my sleep and secondly to help my gut.
Thanks
Fenton J